Author Topic: Finding square  (Read 5027 times)

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Offline RedneckInTraining

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Finding square
« on: August 16, 2019, 07:44:59 am »
When I first started building stuff I never bother to check if something was square.I would tell myself its "good enough" or that it "doesn't matter".But as my projects continued to evolve "good enough" didn't come even close to how I envisioned the idea in my head.With some projects I have considered cutting out everything I did and starting over when I found out just how out of square it ended up.I built a tubular front end for my gambler dodge and instead of having the frame on jackstands and having stable reference points on the concrete.I measured from the concrete with the truck sitting on its tires.After jacking up the truck to check something those points of reference were lost.One error stacked on top of another and when the front end was done one corner was 2" higher than the other  when measured to the ground.The truck looks fine because everything is based of those measurements and the only giveaway is when its parked on something halfway close to flat. I stupidly ASSumed the front end of the truck was square even though I got the truck after it had been nose-rolled in a ditch that mangled the fenders,hood,and doors but left most of the truck "straight" so all my measurements came off the ground for the tubework.I built a rear bumper for it just recently, and I knew that the truck wasnt even remotely square so I based all my measurements off the truck itself.While the rear bumper is not square to the ground its square to the truck so it works out.

A project that seems to occupy most of my thoughts even though I haven't even turned a wrench on it yet is my 1973 plymouth scamp.Like it or not I will be turning the scamp into a car that I can use to go camping ( not inside it) so its gonna be driven down rough gravel roads, at speed.In order to give the car a bit more of chance at surviving the abuse it will be lifted 3" and will run LT tires 29-31" tall.After 46 years the front suspension mounts are tearing out of the sheetmetal, and the factory torsion bars can not provide that much lift while keeping the all important suspension travel needed for dirt roads.So I am going to graft in the front frame and suspension off a 2wd dodge dakota and set it 3" down away from the body relative to "stock".Unlike my other projects this one can't be more than a 1/16" off in any direction.So I plan to measure everything before I start cutting or removing anything.I am also planning on using the nice concrete floor in my new shop to fullest so I plan on transferring measurements from the car to it.

First off how do I make sure the car is as square and straight as possible before I do anything do it?

How can I make sure the car is square to the floor?

When I use a plumb bob and lasers to transcribe measurements to floor what should I use so that they stay intact for the duration of this project?Its gonna take time to get the car done and I'm gonna have to sweep under it from time to time so I dont really want to use chalk lines because I'll have to redo the measurements every time I roll under the car and my shirt just happens to brush against one of the lines.

Once I do have those lines how can I measure vertically straight up from those points to locate the new suspension geometry?

Granted in the 70's mopar didnt really pay that much attention to making things straight,square,and true but even then its probably better than me holding out my thumb and saying "eh,good enough".I'm the one who will be driving it and I want my vision of it to match how it actually turns out.Whats the point of spending alot of effort to make something look cool if the suspension geometry and chassis alignment is so far out of wack that it cant even be driven at 25 mph without out being a white knuckle experience?
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    Offline Elwenil

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #1 on: August 16, 2019, 09:24:29 am »
    Square to the floor is only useful if the floor is perfectly level, which is pretty unheard of in most home garages and shops.  This is why most chassis are built on a frame table or chassis jig.  That way the rig can be leveled with the adjustable legs on the table and you don't have to worry about how wavy the floor is.  Any measurement you would take off a floor that isn't flat isn't worth the time it takes to measure it.  If you don't want to mess with a table or aren't going to do enough with it to make building one worth it, you can get similar results with the screw top jackstands commonly used with RVs and campers.  6 or 8 of them will allow you to level the vehicle and support it well enough to do most things.

    https://smile.amazon.com/Camco-Olympian-Aluminum-Stabilize-Position/dp/B000760FWU/ref=sr_1_4?keywords=rv+jack+stands&qid=1565965444&s=gateway&sr=8-4
    L.Clemons

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    Offline dodge82273

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #2 on: August 16, 2019, 03:16:55 pm »
    find an old auto body shop that had had a "frame machine" for a long time . he would of had charts for the unibody showing where to measure from to check the "square"
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    Offline Mojack

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #3 on: August 16, 2019, 05:40:20 pm »
    When I had my garage built the guy was going to slope the floor a couple of inches for drainage. He couldn't figure me out when I told him NO I want it so level that NASA will want to come here to calibrate their equipment.  Of course I got level as in, a power float :P

    Your Scamp project sounds cool. I know you don't want it to look like a monster truck thingy, but my thoughts go toward using the entire Dakota frame. The factory has already done most of the math for you. All you have to do is section the body down low enough for what you want.
    1979 Trailduster 0 cubic inches, awaiting a 440, a crusty work in progress.

    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #4 on: August 16, 2019, 06:26:35 pm »
    I thought about using an entire dakota frame.It would certainly be easier than welding subframe connectors and torque boxes after the fact to make the chassis as stiff as it should been from the factory.I had a old rusty 93 dakota that I took its 4 cylinder and manual trans and its front clip for another project then I cut the frame off just behind the first cab mount because the frame after that was swiss cheese.Now I can't seem to find any parts dakotas. So right now I have the just the front frame section.

    Setting the car on  a table would be nice but I'm gonna struggle with just getting the car on jackstands high enough that I can work under it.So lifting it high enough to be on a table and high enough off the table to do anything under is kinda impossible.So if I can't use the floor what else could I do to get the new suspension in square?The factory set the suspension tolerance at within 1/4" of square.At the very minimum I could settle for 1/8"
    1994 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD
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    Offline Elwenil

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #5 on: August 16, 2019, 06:33:39 pm »
    Parts Dakota?  I've got a '94 regular cab 2WD here in nice shape.  No one here wants a 2WD truck, even for parts, lol.  Damn thing has been on Craigslist for two months and all I got is two emails asking if it could be driven home when I clearly state in the ad that the transmission only has 1st gear.  ;D
    L.Clemons

    1988 Ramcharger AW450-318EFI-NP435 4 speed-NP205 Transfer Case-Dana 60s-Braden Wormdrive Front Winch

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    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #6 on: August 16, 2019, 08:42:34 pm »
    If only you weren't clear across the country. 4wd dakotas a much more common out here too, although the 2wd swb dakotas are also common,I have one sitting in my driveway but I'm not taking it apart...
    1994 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD
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    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #7 on: August 19, 2019, 06:24:10 am »
    So Ive noticed that extended cab or long box dakotas seem to be more common than regular cab short box dakota.So most likely I will have to shorten the frame for it to fit the car.What is the best way to deal with the frame shortening with respect to the car body?Its highly unlikely that the body floor pan and the truck frame rails have the same raised and flat areas in the same place.I'm thinking that even if I found a regular cab short box dakota to canabilze that the frame and the body wouldnt sit as close together as they could.To get it to sit right would probally require sectioning parts of the frame and altering the wheelbase along with channeling the body.So what about if the frame is longer than what I need?
    1994 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD
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    Offline RXT

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #8 on: August 19, 2019, 09:22:53 pm »
    So Ive noticed that extended cab or long box dakotas seem to be more common than regular cab short box dakota.So most likely I will have to shorten the frame for it to fit the car.What is the best way to deal with the frame shortening with respect to the car body?Its highly unlikely that the body floor pan and the truck frame rails have the same raised and flat areas in the same place.I'm thinking that even if I found a regular cab short box dakota to canabilze that the frame and the body wouldnt sit as close together as they could.To get it to sit right would probally require sectioning parts of the frame and altering the wheelbase along with channeling the body.So what about if the frame is longer than what I need?

    The question you really need to ask yourself is, is this really worth it to do? With the amount of effort this project sounds like it will take, you'd be miles ahead by selling the Scamp for parts and buying something else, like maybe a running Dakota or maybe something like an old AMC Eagle 4wd, or do a van.

    Ed
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    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #9 on: August 20, 2019, 12:01:47 am »
    I'm keeping the scamp it just needs better suspension for bombing down gravel roads.Pickup trucks have horrible unloaded weight distribution so handling at the limit sucks.AMC eagles don't have enough power to get out of their own way,and the single range 4x4 system can't handle snow or mild inclines with out bogging down the already underpowered engine.Vans are too top heavy.

    I have a running driving 4wd dakota with a 5.2L v8 and an autotragic. It plows like a tractor through corners until you provoke the light rear end to come around.Corner exit is sloppy because the rear end cant provide enough forward bite to overcome the inertia of the front end so you end up with alot of tail wagging if your trying to get out of a low speed corner or up a hill.

    The scamp will be much more balanced especially with a 30-40 gallon fuel cell mounted where the back seat normally resides (under a firewall of course).
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    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #10 on: August 20, 2019, 04:02:47 am »
    I'm not going for a monster truck or hardcore 4x4 vehicle, its just the factory front suspension is unsuitable to the abuse it will take.

    I'm looking to make something like this but with commonly available LT tires and enough ground clearance to not worry about all the the football sized rocks that the roads around here seem to grow.



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    Offline CROSSTIE69

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #11 on: August 20, 2019, 10:15:31 am »
    Ive seen guys use big I-beam to build the frame off of. You can level it up and square it up then build the frame on it to keep everything level and square.
    1981 Ramcharger Royal SE, automatic, 360, part time 4X4, stock suspension, 31-10.50 15 tires. Work in progress.

    Offline RXT

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #12 on: August 20, 2019, 02:37:07 pm »
    I'm keeping the scamp it just needs better suspension for bombing down gravel roads…..

    Quote
    Pickup trucks have horrible unloaded weight distribution so handling at the limit sucks.

    You're putting a Scamp on a pick up truck frame. You may end up with a better suspension, but you're not going to get good handling. Especially when you consider that any time you mount an entire car complete with unitized chassis on a truck frame, you're raising the overall COG

    Quote
    AMC eagles don't have enough power to get out of their own way,and the single range 4x4 system can't handle snow or mild inclines with out bogging down the already underpowered engine.Vans are too top heavy.

    Lest I remind you that you wanna put a car on a a 2wd truck frame, the Eagle's 4wd system although it's actually an AWD system, it's still gonna be better traction-wise then any 2wd, and BTW you can replace the AWD t-case with a real t-case. As for how weak, one word; Turbo
     
    Vans still have truck type suspensions which will handle the terrain you're planning to take on. And i would suspect it would handle about as good as a car on a truck frame

    Quote
    I have a running driving 4wd dakota with a 5.2L v8 and an auto tragic. It plows like a tractor through corners until you provoke the light rear end to come around.Corner exit is sloppy because the rear end can't provide enough forward bite to overcome the inertia of the front end so you end up with a lot of tail wagging if your trying to get out of a low speed corner or up a hill.

    Those old 40+ yr old A bodies weren't known to be road course champions, especially with a V8 under the hood, upsetting the overall balance, but then again for the desire of a better suspension, how do you suppose a Scamp on a 2wd Dakota frame will handle??

    If you want a rally car, forget the Dakota frame/front end and just rebuild and reenforce the Scamp's suspension. Thats pretty much how the Mustang and Javelin were built.

    Ed
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    Offline Elwenil

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #13 on: August 20, 2019, 02:57:39 pm »
    The Flying Green Brick did very well against a lot of the more common "sports cars".  My own Charger did very well at speed and did well enough to spank the new Camaros and Mudstains of the late '90s.

    L.Clemons

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    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #14 on: August 20, 2019, 03:49:21 pm »
    The factory torsion bars can be made to handle I'll give you that.With the torsion bars I *could* crank the bars up to max to make bigger tires fit but it would kill suspension travel,ride quality,and front end grip.Any ideas how I could lift the front 3" and keep the suspension in the middle of its travel?
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    Offline Elwenil

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #15 on: August 20, 2019, 04:18:22 pm »
    Use the thickest torsion bars you can find.  You can cut, clock and weld the torsion bar anchor on the transmission crossmember to gain or lose height adjustment.  The ball joint angle will be your main limitation, but I believe most of the older Mopars do have tubular control arms available.  Or you could cut it all out and go with a Mudstain II front suspension and rack steering.  Honestly I have no issues with my Charger's front suspension.  Road race torsion bars, oversize roll bar, poly bushings and Koni adjustable shocks made it handle pretty damn good.  The rear leaf springs were a bit more trouble to get calmed down.  Some cheap coil overs for added support, and moving a set of clamps up and down the length of the springs helped a lot but I had to be careful with the amount of travel or the tires would rub.
    L.Clemons

    1988 Ramcharger AW450-318EFI-NP435 4 speed-NP205 Transfer Case-Dana 60s-Braden Wormdrive Front Winch

    2018 Ram 2500HD Crew Cab 4WD 5.7L

    I am the unknown Will,
    The Anger that threatens glory and ruin:
    Lord of Storms am I,
    in heaven high and caverns deep.
    I am the Father of the War,
    Odin for you, Wotan for him,
    Wayfarer, Wanderer, beggar, king,
    numen, genius, strength and ring.

    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #16 on: August 20, 2019, 04:42:09 pm »
    I've heard a rumor that dodge van spindles might fit and give a bit of lift any truth to that?

    As far as moostang front suspension why not use the dakota front suspension that I have?
    1994 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD
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    Offline Elwenil

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #17 on: August 20, 2019, 05:45:02 pm »
    No idea on what spindles will swap.  I know there was some swapping with C-body parts done to the B-bodies, but I don't know what would work on an A-body.  If you could find the build articles for Ehrenberg's Flying Green Brick you could see what all he did to his Valiant to run the One Lap of America which was pretty successful.  For me, the choice of a Mudstain II front would be the aftermarket support.  You aren't likely to find much that will worth with a Dakota unless you can find some spare Viper parts laying around.  If your Dakota has the oddball 6 lug pattern, you are pretty much dead before you get started.
    L.Clemons

    1988 Ramcharger AW450-318EFI-NP435 4 speed-NP205 Transfer Case-Dana 60s-Braden Wormdrive Front Winch

    2018 Ram 2500HD Crew Cab 4WD 5.7L

    I am the unknown Will,
    The Anger that threatens glory and ruin:
    Lord of Storms am I,
    in heaven high and caverns deep.
    I am the Father of the War,
    Odin for you, Wotan for him,
    Wayfarer, Wanderer, beggar, king,
    numen, genius, strength and ring.

    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #18 on: August 20, 2019, 07:27:42 pm »
    The dakota pieces I have are the 6 lug but its easy enough to convert it to 5 lug.

    As far as aftermarket support goes how many moostang 2 suspension kits are designed for max suspension travel on rough roads?Eventually I might modify the front suspension for more travel.
    1994 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD
    1987 Dodge Dakota 3.9 V6

                          RON PAUL- 2012
    Governments control people. Who CONTROLS the GOVERNMENTS of the people?

    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #19 on: August 20, 2019, 08:07:25 pm »
    Well crap.I looked at the dakota front end and the scamp front end(as close I could with wasps swarming around) and it looks like the A body suspension would be better for long travel.The dakota suspension is currently sitting at max height because its coil springs are just supporting about 5 feet of frame, and it looks to have roughly 3" of travel before it touches the up travel bump stops.To get any better it would a small diameter coil-over to go from the lower control arm through the center of the upper control arm to a shock hoop.The factory spring pocket would need to be removed and the upper control arm itself would need a different shape.

    The Scamp on the other hand has its shock going through the upper control arm already and the control arm pivots are outboard of the "frame" so the upper control arm wouldnt have any interference issues with suspension travel.From a quick glance all the scamp would need other than the control arm mounts braced up would be a coilover long enough for the travel i'm looking for.

    Making new upper and lower A arms and finding a coil-over that would lift it 3" would be much easier than cutting and welding in a new front subframe.
    1994 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD
    1987 Dodge Dakota 3.9 V6

                          RON PAUL- 2012
    Governments control people. Who CONTROLS the GOVERNMENTS of the people?

    Offline Mad Max

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #20 on: August 21, 2019, 09:34:07 am »
    okay - I have to chime in on this one :).  My vote is to upgrade the Scamp's suspension and run it vs grafting in another similar suspension.  I road-raced my '71 Demon GTS-R for a few years which included several chassis and suspension mods, which I'll review now.

    Front end.  I used the 1.14" torsion bars - which were the biggest I could buy from Mopar at the time.  With the adjuster bolts all the way out the chassis was still too high, and with the bars indexed 1/6th is was too low - the bars were so stiff that I had to cut/re-index the chassis mounds under the floor 1/12th of a position to split the difference in the hex-head bar ends.  It was a pain but it was worth it - I lowered the chassis just the right amount.  I also used Magnum Force Racing upper control arms to allow for the additional drop.  I used 'newer' 73-up A-body spindles and BIG 12(?) inch brakes/calipers from a Fury.

    The rear was tubbed 3 inches and had custom leafs with oil-lite bronze bushings.  The car handles amazingly well considering the relatively low-tech approach.  I'd wager your Scamp would perform just fine with an upgraded/modified factory setup. 

    Here's a video of the Demon - it's a crappy video but it shows how hard I pushed the front end into the turns, and it had an all-iron 440 under the hood.  The chassis never let me down.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVM6QidOFbo

    If you crank up the torsion bars and modify the rebound bumpers I think you'll get as close to what you're after if not better than grafting in a Dakota or other chassis {cool}

    - Sam
    « Last Edit: August 21, 2019, 09:36:34 am by Mad Max »
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    Offline dodge82273

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #21 on: August 21, 2019, 02:48:34 pm »
    a 1993 4x4 dakota used torsion bars ...
    78 to 93 parts trucks
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    Offline Mad Max

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #22 on: August 21, 2019, 03:35:31 pm »
    yes I know - my point was I think an A-body likely has as much adjustment potential as a Dakota...unless it's a matter of ride height to clear tires and 'stacking' a frame under the A-body front end is required...in which case I think I'd do a solid axle swap (SAS) with a basic set of 48" RC springs and a D44 before grafting in a Dakota (or any other) torsion bar frame section.  A SAS on an A-body kinda actually sounds like fun :)
    « Last Edit: August 21, 2019, 03:37:59 pm by Mad Max »
    2002 Dakota Quad Cab 4x4 - 440/46rh/Atlas4/D60/14b/40s
    2007 Cummins Ram 3500 Megadually 4x4 "Big Mack" - 5.9/G56 6-speed
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    1952 Willys M-38 "Poncho"

                    ….there's always a way...

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    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #23 on: August 21, 2019, 04:28:12 pm »
    Current plan is to brace up the scamps suspension  mounting points then build new upper and lower control arms that will put the spindle/hub 3" lower.I'm gonna design it to use regular bushings and ball joints so the ball joints will be angled up so they are parallel to the spindle at ride height.I wont get as much travel as heims and uniballs but parts will be readily available, and bushings at the control arms will have a bit of compliance to minimize the stress on the body.I will either use the dakota or the scamps spindles depending on which one looks like it would have better geometry.I will also use the dakota rack and pinion steering.

    Yes I know 4wd dakotas are torsion bar,this car is NOT going to be 4wd, so I was gonna use 2wd dakota suspension.

    Now I need to be brave and pull the scamp out from the weeds and wrestle it away from the army of wasps that have  made it their home so I can start measuring stuff.
    1994 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD
    1987 Dodge Dakota 3.9 V6

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    Offline rb89318

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #24 on: August 22, 2019, 07:11:07 am »
    The later B-bodies, Cordoba, etc, had Isloated K-members. FirmFeel  Possible to space the K-member down a bit to get a little more lift.

    Roadkill did an offroad challenger, and Dirt Every Day did a 4x4 roadrunner.
    Formerly rb70383
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    Offline Elwenil

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #25 on: August 22, 2019, 07:14:14 am »
    '73 and up used the isolated K-member.
    L.Clemons

    1988 Ramcharger AW450-318EFI-NP435 4 speed-NP205 Transfer Case-Dana 60s-Braden Wormdrive Front Winch

    2018 Ram 2500HD Crew Cab 4WD 5.7L

    I am the unknown Will,
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    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #26 on: August 22, 2019, 05:51:36 pm »
    Roadkills offroad challenger was them cutting up an old circle track car to fit bigger tires,and dirt every days road runner had a new "frame" welded under it with aftermarket solid axles,4wd,and a late model diesel engine..Neither option really built new and improved suspension geometry to work with the car itself.
    1994 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD
    1987 Dodge Dakota 3.9 V6

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    Offline dodge82273

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #27 on: August 23, 2019, 02:25:35 am »
    and 90% of that junk does NOT belong on a public road with my loved ones .
    78 to 93 parts trucks
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    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #28 on: August 23, 2019, 03:28:29 am »
    What?
    1994 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD
    1987 Dodge Dakota 3.9 V6

                          RON PAUL- 2012
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    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #29 on: September 3, 2019, 12:28:16 am »
    I spent some time tearing apart the oil rusty dakota front frame section/suspension.I made a home made mixture of equal parts diesel,atf,and mineral spirits and squirted it on all the rusty suspension nuts/bolts and let it sit for the time it to bring out my underpowered harbor freight corded impact wrench and an extension cord.Hit it with the impact all of the nuts came free with the impact,Normally you have to help it with a breaker bar, but atf/diesel/mineral spirits seemed to do the trick.Every bolt showed signs that the mixture penetrated into the threads, so save some money on penetrating oil and just make some yourself.

    Anyway I took the spring out and cycled the suspension.There is not alot of room before the suspension hits either the upper or lower bump stop.I removed the bump stops and got a fair bit more travel before the upper control arm would hit on the frame/upper bump pad.The balljoints and tie rod ends still had alot of movement left at that point.To get more travel than it left the factory with means cutting out the frame between the upper and lower control arm as well as the upper spring cup, and revising the control arms slightly.Then just running a coilover shock.So I'm gonna see what I can get out the dakota suspension because it is much more robust than the scamps suspension.Worse case scenario-I cut up an old rusty and crusty dakota frame...
    1994 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD
    1987 Dodge Dakota 3.9 V6

                          RON PAUL- 2012
    Governments control people. Who CONTROLS the GOVERNMENTS of the people?

    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #30 on: September 18, 2019, 12:57:44 pm »
    So I'm looking for a 2wd dakota frame and 97+ dakotas are much more common.I was thinking of using a frame from a 87-90 preferably for the 5 lug, or a 91-96 just so I can convert it back to 5 lug.Would their be any valid reason to use a 97+ frame over a 87-96 frame/suspension.I'm not overly thrilled with the weird 6 lug dakota pattern.
    1994 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD
    1987 Dodge Dakota 3.9 V6

                          RON PAUL- 2012
    Governments control people. Who CONTROLS the GOVERNMENTS of the people?

    Offline Elwenil

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #31 on: September 18, 2019, 06:20:51 pm »
    '94 2WD regular cab long bed here.  ;D
    L.Clemons

    1988 Ramcharger AW450-318EFI-NP435 4 speed-NP205 Transfer Case-Dana 60s-Braden Wormdrive Front Winch

    2018 Ram 2500HD Crew Cab 4WD 5.7L

    I am the unknown Will,
    The Anger that threatens glory and ruin:
    Lord of Storms am I,
    in heaven high and caverns deep.
    I am the Father of the War,
    Odin for you, Wotan for him,
    Wayfarer, Wanderer, beggar, king,
    numen, genius, strength and ring.

    Offline RedneckInTraining

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #32 on: September 19, 2019, 06:45:37 pm »
    Much to far away.
    1994 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD
    1987 Dodge Dakota 3.9 V6

                          RON PAUL- 2012
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    Offline RXT

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    Re: Finding square
    « Reply #33 on: September 26, 2019, 11:34:34 am »
    So I'm looking for a 2wd dakota frame and 97+ dakotas are much more common.I was thinking of using a frame from a 87-90 preferably for the 5 lug, or a 91-96 just so I can convert it back to 5 lug.Would their be any valid reason to use a 97+ frame over a 87-96 frame/suspension.I'm not overly thrilled with the weird 6 lug dakota pattern.


    Who cares about the lug pattern…If anything, install thicker lugs for greater wheel retention strength.

    And BTW, you might want to look into this for greater wheel travel;
    http://www.doetsch-shocks.com/17.asp
    (2wd Dakota lift)

    Ed
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