4 Wheel Parts
4WD
ALLDATAdiy
JC Whitney
Off-Road Tires
Dodge Parts
Canadian insurance for your Charger


Author Topic: slow cranking? (solved)  (Read 1758 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Unfortunate_Sam

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 233
  • Gender: Male
slow cranking? (solved)
« on: March 22, 2012, 02:34:16 PM »
Ok, after having solved many issues I'm finally down to the home stretch on my75 318 RC.

However, Now I'm getting very slow cranking.

Ok so today I got it to fire for the first time in months it ran for about 10 seconds and then stumbled and died, I tried to crank it again but it was cranking to slow to fire, the starter is new and has always cranked just fine until now. Why would it all of a sudden be cranking so slow.

I was just messing with it again moved the distributor around while trying to crank it and got nothing faster, it backfired a couple times the motor wants to start it's just not cranking fast enough to start so I can finish dialing it in.

Any ideas?
« Last Edit: March 22, 2012, 08:36:07 PM by Unfortunate_Sam »
1999 RAM2500 V10/NV4500HD/NP241HD(TX)
1988 Jeep Cherokee I6 5speed 4x4(TX)
1975 Dodge Ramcharger 318/727/NP203 pt(CA)
1952 M38A2(CJ5) 273V8/3speed w OD/4x4(CA)

Offline Unfortunate_Sam

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 233
  • Gender: Male
Re: slow cranking?
« Reply #1 on: March 22, 2012, 02:35:48 PM »
It does two slow spins and then a slightly faster spin.
1999 RAM2500 V10/NV4500HD/NP241HD(TX)
1988 Jeep Cherokee I6 5speed 4x4(TX)
1975 Dodge Ramcharger 318/727/NP203 pt(CA)
1952 M38A2(CJ5) 273V8/3speed w OD/4x4(CA)

Offline Captain Obvious

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3553
  • Gender: Male
    • How to find truck help fast
Re: slow cranking?
« Reply #2 on: March 22, 2012, 02:39:12 PM »
Slow cranking:

poor current to starter due to corrosion/weak battery/loose connections
internal starter defect
engine/drivetrain mechanically binding
ignition advanced too far
starter heat soaked


Out of the above 5, only one is very plausible.

Offline PowerDragon

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1614
  • Gender: Male
  • Sure, I'll race your Ferrari, I choose the terrain
Re: slow cranking?
« Reply #3 on: March 22, 2012, 02:39:56 PM »
Did you ever tighten down your battery clamps after that ignition situation?
'77 Club Cab "PowerDragon"
'77 Ramcharger, wife's "Mack"
'97 Ram 1500 "Red"
'73 Plymouth Scamp wife's "Snotty"
'00 Buell M2 Cyclone "Duc Hunter"
'94 ATK 260 ($500, it's yours)

Offline Unfortunate_Sam

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 233
  • Gender: Male
Re: slow cranking?
« Reply #4 on: March 22, 2012, 02:41:34 PM »
Yes my battery clamps are tightened, I did it while trying to figure out my ignition system issue
1999 RAM2500 V10/NV4500HD/NP241HD(TX)
1988 Jeep Cherokee I6 5speed 4x4(TX)
1975 Dodge Ramcharger 318/727/NP203 pt(CA)
1952 M38A2(CJ5) 273V8/3speed w OD/4x4(CA)

Offline Unfortunate_Sam

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 233
  • Gender: Male
Re: slow cranking?
« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2012, 02:46:11 PM »
poor current to starter due to corrosion/weak battery/loose connections (unlikely)
internal starter defect                                                                         (possible)
engine/drivetrain mechanically binding                                                 (very unlikely)
ignition advanced too far                                                                     (Likely)
starter heat soaked                                                                             (definatley not)

So? its probably my ignition timing. How would that be slowing down my cold cranking? Is there anyway to get it right with an engine that doesn't start?

Again it has always cranked fine until just now, I'm gonna go take the distributor out and see if it cranks fast if so I'll know. If not I get to do more "fiddling".
1999 RAM2500 V10/NV4500HD/NP241HD(TX)
1988 Jeep Cherokee I6 5speed 4x4(TX)
1975 Dodge Ramcharger 318/727/NP203 pt(CA)
1952 M38A2(CJ5) 273V8/3speed w OD/4x4(CA)

Offline Captain Obvious

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3553
  • Gender: Male
    • How to find truck help fast
Re: slow cranking?
« Reply #6 on: March 22, 2012, 02:53:45 PM »
Pull the coil wire, that's all you have to do.

In some cases where the engine tries to fire too far down the hole, that extra pressure strains the starter. Piston trying to push backwards, starter still trying to push upwards.

I am still voting on some different connection being insufficient.

Still want to know voltage reading between engine block and negative post. Not touching anything positive, want to know if voltage shows up while cranking engine. It's fast, it's precise, it leaves no doubts on that side of circuit.

Offline Unfortunate_Sam

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 233
  • Gender: Male
Re: slow cranking?
« Reply #7 on: March 22, 2012, 03:04:29 PM »
Well I just did some voltage reading the batery is putting out just below 11 and the starter is getting about the same I also checked at the alternator and several places in the cab and I'm getting just below 11 volts so I have no abnormal power drops I'll got check check that list you just gave me, and the timing is not the issue.
1999 RAM2500 V10/NV4500HD/NP241HD(TX)
1988 Jeep Cherokee I6 5speed 4x4(TX)
1975 Dodge Ramcharger 318/727/NP203 pt(CA)
1952 M38A2(CJ5) 273V8/3speed w OD/4x4(CA)

Offline Unfortunate_Sam

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 233
  • Gender: Male
Re: slow cranking?
« Reply #8 on: March 22, 2012, 03:12:51 PM »
Ok, while cranking my battery - post to engine block ground is getting no more than 0.45 volts. Is that acceptable?
1999 RAM2500 V10/NV4500HD/NP241HD(TX)
1988 Jeep Cherokee I6 5speed 4x4(TX)
1975 Dodge Ramcharger 318/727/NP203 pt(CA)
1952 M38A2(CJ5) 273V8/3speed w OD/4x4(CA)

Offline Captain Obvious

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3553
  • Gender: Male
    • How to find truck help fast
Re: slow cranking?
« Reply #9 on: March 22, 2012, 03:20:19 PM »
It's a little high, but not drastic.

If you have alligator clips the same thing can be done from the lead actual battery terminal on positive side to the big stud on starter terminal. That's pretty tricky because while someone has to hold it, someone else has to be cranking. On positive post to starter stud .5 could be livable, like to see less on negative side.

Almost nothing would be even better, but due to undersized factory terminals and moderate tarnish, gonna get some sorts of readings.

Once you know you have power to the starter, it's pretty easy to condemn the starter itself since mechanic binding and over advance is all but eliminated.

If battery voltage stays decently high and neither cable shows significant voltage, it can be assumed good under mist circumstances as well.

Offline Unfortunate_Sam

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 233
  • Gender: Male
Re: slow cranking?
« Reply #10 on: March 22, 2012, 03:30:51 PM »
Hmm, well I have had problems with these kragens starters before this is #4 they just crank kinda slow I had one that cranked like crazy but that one ended up getting overloaded and shorted or locked up. Unfortunately the only alligator clips I have are on my starter trigger thing so I don't have to be in the cab to turn over the motor. So I won't be able to do that test especially since I'm the only person home today.

I know there is plenty of voltage going to the starter, i mean the battery might just  be going dead, but if it was cranking so slow off the battery it would have run out of juice by now i would think and its still giving good acceptable voltage.
1999 RAM2500 V10/NV4500HD/NP241HD(TX)
1988 Jeep Cherokee I6 5speed 4x4(TX)
1975 Dodge Ramcharger 318/727/NP203 pt(CA)
1952 M38A2(CJ5) 273V8/3speed w OD/4x4(CA)

Offline Captain Obvious

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3553
  • Gender: Male
    • How to find truck help fast
Re: slow cranking?
« Reply #11 on: March 22, 2012, 03:56:05 PM »
What is being attempted by testing while starter is turning, is it is putting a real life stress test on your electrical components.

Don't wanna see someone drop $100 on starter and find out they still have a problem, times are tough.

BUT if starter needs replaced, I suggest stop using one for a 70s truck and start using one for a 90s truck. They are simply better. About the only way they usually fail, short of physical damage, is burnt out solenoids, and you can fix those for dirt cheap, sometimes w/o even removing starter.

I think this site even has a few write ups about what many of us mopar guys have known about factory mini-starters for quite some time.

http://ramchargercentral.com/parts-compatibility-and-interchange-discussion/dokota-starter/

Offline PowerDragon

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1614
  • Gender: Male
  • Sure, I'll race your Ferrari, I choose the terrain
Re: slow cranking?
« Reply #12 on: March 22, 2012, 04:00:53 PM »
What is being attempted by testing while starter is turning, is it is putting a real life stress test on your electrical components.

Don't wanna see someone drop $100 on starter and find out they still have a problem, times are tough.

BUT if starter needs replaced, I suggest stop using one for a 70s truck and start using one for a 90s truck. They are simply better. About the only way they usually fail, short of physical damage, is burnt out solenoids, and you can fix those for dirt cheap, sometimes w/o even removing starter.

I think this site even has a few write ups about what many of us mopar guys have known about factory mini-starters for quite some time.


x2  We've been ordering starters for a '97 ram 1500 for everything else we have running a SB.
'77 Club Cab "PowerDragon"
'77 Ramcharger, wife's "Mack"
'97 Ram 1500 "Red"
'73 Plymouth Scamp wife's "Snotty"
'00 Buell M2 Cyclone "Duc Hunter"
'94 ATK 260 ($500, it's yours)

Offline Unfortunate_Sam

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 233
  • Gender: Male
Re: slow cranking?
« Reply #13 on: March 22, 2012, 04:23:38 PM »
Ya I'm gonna swap in a known good charged battery this afternoon if it isn't raining, and see if it was the battery, if its the starter I have the receipt around here somewhere and I believe it has a lifetime warranty so I'll just get an exchange to a high torque mini starter depending.
1999 RAM2500 V10/NV4500HD/NP241HD(TX)
1988 Jeep Cherokee I6 5speed 4x4(TX)
1975 Dodge Ramcharger 318/727/NP203 pt(CA)
1952 M38A2(CJ5) 273V8/3speed w OD/4x4(CA)

Offline Unfortunate_Sam

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 233
  • Gender: Male
Re: slow cranking?
« Reply #14 on: March 22, 2012, 08:35:25 PM »
Ok, I'm not sure if is of any help but I took a voltage reading off the starter while cranking of less 1 volt.

Anyway I just put my battery into another truck and the battery is pretty much dead. So I have to believe that my battery is just draining really fast. So I'm gonna have to see if i can't get it replaced under warranty. Unless those shorts I was having with my ECU plug could have drained a ton of battery life.

Either way problem resolved I just have to get a charged battery hopefully.

Also thanks to all of you for helping with these little issues over the last couple weeks, for the most part I've just been over thinking the issues. But seriously without RCC it would take me a lot longer to trouble shoot these issues. So thanks captain obvious and and everybody else for your help and patience.
1999 RAM2500 V10/NV4500HD/NP241HD(TX)
1988 Jeep Cherokee I6 5speed 4x4(TX)
1975 Dodge Ramcharger 318/727/NP203 pt(CA)
1952 M38A2(CJ5) 273V8/3speed w OD/4x4(CA)

Offline Captain Obvious

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3553
  • Gender: Male
    • How to find truck help fast
Re: slow cranking? (solved)
« Reply #15 on: March 22, 2012, 08:52:39 PM »
more importantly, can you get another battery in there temporarily and finally get this thing fired up?

Offline Unfortunate_Sam

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 233
  • Gender: Male
Re: slow cranking? (solved)
« Reply #16 on: March 22, 2012, 08:59:40 PM »
Unfortunately, probably not. All the good charged batteries are in use. :-\
1999 RAM2500 V10/NV4500HD/NP241HD(TX)
1988 Jeep Cherokee I6 5speed 4x4(TX)
1975 Dodge Ramcharger 318/727/NP203 pt(CA)
1952 M38A2(CJ5) 273V8/3speed w OD/4x4(CA)

 

email