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"industrial" 413

55K views 64 replies 15 participants last post by  40WillysCP 
#1 ·
what all is there that is unique to the industrial 413 block. i just picked mine up today. it came out of a 73 chrysler dump truck supposedly(have no proof). this thing has a massive water pump on it. and the guy i bought it off of was telling me how some aircraft mechanic that was good with chryslers was telling them it might have been punched out to be a 540...? never heard of that. if that was even possible, how is that determined? just looking for some info on this motor. it is complete and was interested on any tips to do to it before i put it in my rc project. thanks

Andrew

will get pictures tomorrow since its dark here.
 
#2 ·
There is no way that engine was punched out to equal 540ci.  The general rule of thumb is (If i remember correctly) for every .060 Overbore you gain 10 Cubic Inches.

The most i've ever heard of a Chrysler Engine being bored out is .090 to .100 (.090 for some Marine Smallblocks, .100 for some very far and few beefy 340 T/A Engines like i have in my Duster)
 
#3 ·
I had a 413 from a motorhome with the same huge water pump as you are describing. Instead of a timing chain, it was direct gear to gear, no idlers or cheater gears. So, the cam turned backwards. That can be remedied though, if wanted. Also had super low compression dished pistons. Did have a good crank and rods though...
 
#6 ·
yeah i pretty much let the number 540 go in one ear and out the other. i will be using this motor for the time being. is their anything that can be done to step this motor up a notch?
ToxicDoc said:
Which would be good for turbo charging... Think big ;)
thats something i was hoping to hear... ;D
 
#7 ·
ToxicDoc said:
Which would be good for turbo charging... Think big ;)
Several years ago, I was thinking big. Then I realized low compression or not, factory cast pistons are a no-no. {dont} So aftermarket pistons would be required. Almost non-existent in the 413 camp.

Overall, that motor would be great for turbo-ing, especially since they did it in the 70s. Then again, with turbo, still only made about high 200s-300hp.

Think you need a body lift to clear the water pump, can't remember?
 
#8 ·
I have the 413's baby brother, aka. the 361. It is in a D600 truck dad bought, was an old army truck. Anyway it does really well in that truck, we have hauled some massive loads with it and it does so without a wimper. As for what different, I know the exhaust ports are different, so normal BB headers are out. Industrial ones are around $350, and their aren't to many choices. The cam is also different, not sure if you can swap out the front gears and use the standard BB cam. Didn't look into that. As for the heads they are also different from the standard ones. The coolant passages are different, and the heads are a lot thicker. The intake manifolds are special and are very heavy. I wanted to swap on a 4bbl intake so it could breathe a little better, but I couldn't find a used one. And new they were very expensive. I may need to anyways though, if you really get into it yu can hear it trying to suck the aircleaner into the engine, and by the way it sounds it just might do that :eek: If you have any more questions ask,
DS79
 
#9 ·
I agree with cast pistons and high boost, but low boost, less than 6 psi with a slightly rich mix could be doable.  Although for the prices of new pistons (if he breaks them), he could do a 440.
 
#10 ·
ToxicDoc said:
I agree with cast pistons and high boost, but low boost, less than 6 psi with a slightly rich mix could be doable. Although for the prices of new pistons (if he breaks them), he could do a 440.
Right, I do agree with low boost part. Then again, it'll still be a 300hp RB engine, just with a lot more $$$ and time than a nearly stock 440 truck engine, or detuned car engine.

None the less, a GREAT engine to learn on, especially in the rebuild/tear down, ect ect department.
 
#11 ·
I had a 72 Winnebago with the  I413. The block, crank, rods and pistons are like any others. The heads look like a crossbred small block/ big block head. They have extra water jackets that match the unique intake manifold for water to flow through them. The engine with the heads, exhaust manifolds and water pump system wont fit in your RC.  .
 
#12 ·
the guy i bought it off of had it in an 80's dodge pickup. don't know the year since he cut it up. so i'm going to have to say it will fit. all he told me in that department is that a very small notch is needed for clearance on the frame. from what i'm reading, i take it you can pretty much swap the top half of a BB RB engine onto this motor? just looking at options. i want to freshen this motor up a lot before dropping it in. and i go deep with it, i want to do it once and be done.

 
#14 ·
It doesn't look like it sticks up anymore than the carb.  It might fit, but then again I don't have it here in front of me to say for sure.  Interesting engine to say the least.
 
#15 ·
Will a normal water pump house mount to the engine?
 
#16 ·
thats what i would like to know. i'm interested if i can put on some regular heads and intake maybe. or i may run with it like it is. i'm just trying to gather some knowledge on this motor since there's not a lot of info out there on these motors.
 
#17 ·
I would spend as little money on it as possible.  Just clean it and run it.  If you gotta buy regular heads etc you may as well buy a different (ie 440) engine.
 
#18 ·
Is that a Temperature Sending Unit for a Mechanical Water Temperature Gauge threaded into the Exhaust Manifold in the 3rd Picture  ???
 
#19 ·
yeah i don't want a lot of money into it. just want that seat of the pants torque.

ChrisKD said:
Is that a Temperature Sending Unit for a Mechanical Water Temperature Gauge threaded into the Exhaust Manifold in the 3rd Picture ???
thats what i was thinking. there's another on the other side as well.

i've used the handy search on this motor here. seems a few select people have used them. any pointers on what you all did would be greatly appreciated. i'm going to use this motor until i get the time to do a full on build of another big block and just swap them out.
 
#20 ·
Perhaps the sending units are for an exhaust temp gauge?  The late '70s Champion RV my buddy pickup has the gauge though it doesn't work and it's just a 360.  Seemed sort of odd to me considering it's not a diesel or turbo charged, but it was the '70s.
 
#22 ·
Hard to say.  There were a lot of odd things going on in the '70s with the new emissions regulations, lower compression engines and poor quality fuel.  There were water injection setups that were supposed to keep the head and manifolds cooler to deal with the higher combustion temperatures and all sorts of other strange things.  Remember, it was an RV engine.
 
#23 ·
Elwenil said:
It doesn't look like it sticks up anymore than the carb. It might fit, but then again I don't have it here in front of me to say for sure. Interesting engine to say the least.
Try to explain fan blade to shroud/hood clearance in a D/W truck. :p Hence the previous statement about needing a body lift.

Not sure what all the commotion is about the bourdan tube in the exhaust. The manifolds are water cooled if I'm not mistaken? I mean have water passages there anyways. ???

It's not a EGT thermocouple that is for sure.
 
#24 ·
Electric fans, lol.  I guess that's what I was thinking since I used them on my big block swap and the missing fan or raised location didn't seem odd to me, lol.
 
#25 ·
Industrial 413s from the early 70s were cast with the 440 water jackets, essentially an underbored 440 with the extra ribbing on the side of the block that they called the "cold weather" block.  These blocks have no casting number, only a casting date.  They can be bored out to standard 426 or 440 bores sizes.  They have a great steel crank and usually LY rods, but they also have an extra thick forged crank balancer, and none of the pulleys and accessory brackets will work with standard passenger car heads and water pump.  Stock pistons are in the 7.? to 1 range.

The main differences are the heads, water pump housing, and exhaust manifolds.  The water pump housing directs coolant straight from the radiator directly into the front of the heads.  The heads have small sodium filled valves that can handle full throttle temperatures for long periods up long grades.  The exhaust manifolds are unique to those heads.  The intake manifold is a standard RB intake and will swap onto regular heads.  Really, these motors were the peak of gas medium truck engine evolution, right when these type of vehicles were switching over to diesel.  The industrial 413 is a bitchin motor for grinding up a long grade at full throttle at 4000 rpm!  You find them in alot of old dump trucks, too.

You could run it as is, or you can yank the heads and water pump and switch to some standard heads.  Its a great core motor, because its got a forged steel crank and you can way overbore it.  I've got one of these blocks sitting in my shop.  Scored it for $75 and used the crank and rods for my 440 build... {beer}
 
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