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Author Topic: 4bt motor mounts  (Read 9609 times)

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Offline J10Mike

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4bt motor mounts
« on: February 13, 2011, 02:37:15 AM »
Is there a ready made motor mount for the 4bt conversion into a 72 thru 93 Dodge truck?
I have been a member of 4btswaps.com for some time now and have seen only a few 4bt Dodge truck conversions.
I did go thru the giant "Show your motor mounts" thread there without settling on an adequate solution. I saw only three 4bt conversions there with all being custom or semi custom mounts.
I have both the 6bt mounts from my doner truck and the 4bt mounts from the step van. Has anybody used a combination of either mounts?
I find it odd that there are companies out there that have developed bolt on and or weld on 4bt motor mounts for Jeep, Ford, and Chevrolet trucks. Yet, nothing for Dodge trucks. What's with that? I thought Cummins was a Dodge thing. You would think that with the Cummins integration with Dodge trucks that somebody out there would have thought about producing a motor mount for the 4bt conversion into the 72 thru 93 Dodge truck.
Maybe I'm wrong. I'll keep searching. 
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1977 Ramcharger, CTD 4bt/46rh/NP241, 6 inch lift, BFG M/T 35s, Front D60 w/Detroit Truetrac. Rear HD60 w/Detroit Locker.

2000 Dodge Ram 2500 QC, CTD, 4x4...Juiced.

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Offline jungle

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2011, 05:03:21 AM »
Does the 4BT have multiple mount locations like the 6BT has?
Jim
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Offline J10Mike

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #2 on: February 13, 2011, 02:41:59 PM »
Ya Jim,
There are 4 bolt mounts identical to the 89 thru 93 at mid block. There are also 3 bolt mounts near the front of the block and were used in the step vans.
I came across mounts for Jeep CJ, YJ, and TJ at the below link. They are adaptable to other makes of vehicle. But, at $390 for both sides, just a bit out of my price range.
I have also seen a RC 4bt conversion using a second gen passenger side mount that bolts on. And, I believe a Ford motor mount for the driver side. I need to send this guy a message and get the specifics on his mounts. They may just do the trick.

http://www.jdjeepstore.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2570&products_id=773046392
www.j10mike.com

1977 Ramcharger, CTD 4bt/46rh/NP241, 6 inch lift, BFG M/T 35s, Front D60 w/Detroit Truetrac. Rear HD60 w/Detroit Locker.

2000 Dodge Ram 2500 QC, CTD, 4x4...Juiced.

2006 Dodge Charger R/T Daytona - DD

Former Rig: 1982 Jeep J10 Sportside.

Offline airgrabber70

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #3 on: February 20, 2011, 10:11:55 PM »
Mike, I have a 4bt in a TD.  I used the small block rubber mounts from the 360 that I took out and made brackets that bolt to the engine (front 3 holes) and the stock v8 location on the crossmember.  It was really easy and I didn't take a picture again.   Scott

Offline cragdweller

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2011, 12:56:46 PM »
Airgrabber, can we get some pics of your 4BT conversion?
1975 Plymouth Trail Duster Sport.  440/727, 203/205 doubler, Dana 60 front and 70 rear.  Still under construction...

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Offline airgrabber70

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2011, 07:53:20 PM »
I can post some. I have posted in the past but not sure what topic its under. 

Offline leftbehindinohio

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #6 on: February 22, 2011, 02:46:26 PM »
  I have been doing some research of my own on this. I'm wanting to drop my 4BT into a Pop Top frame. Apparently, you can bolt the "stands" from a 6BT onto a 4BT. The stands are the cast iron pieces bolted to the block that the rubber mounts bolt to. I was told that the 4BT will then "drop right in" to the existing 4x4 engine crossmember. This will keep the back of the engine towards the firewall and leave a lot of room in front to stuff in an intercooler and use a factory sized radiator. This cat I talked to claims to have done two of these conversions but amazingly, not a picture to be had ANYWHERE... >:( I'm no fabricator and my hope is to stay as "bolt-in" as possible.
  Please, don't quote me on anything above. Until I see it with my own eyes, it's purely folklore.
  Maybe we could start our own thread on the 4BT's when we get more info? I am on 4BT Swaps, as well and you would think that there would be more Dodge applications ???
  I would love to see any/all of your conversion pics too, airgrabber70. I need some inspiration and plans to get this project moving again.  :)

Offline Mad Max

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2011, 03:14:35 PM »
IIRC one of the problems with the 4BT d-side mount is the power steering pump - there isn't the same clearance as there is with a 6BT.  I think you have to use the non-intercooled vacuum pump and power steering unit....I think.
I also think I remember the p-side mount is nearly a bolt-in from the 6BT, but the d-side is voodoo.

Something else I heard recently, the 4BT's =SHAKE= a lot more than the 6BTs do, and are louder, which has disuaded several folks from a 4BT swap.

- Sam
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Offline leftbehindinohio

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2011, 04:13:44 PM »
 I have heard the same thing about the PS pump. I guess you can use the Chevy setup, if you're engine came from a step-van. Also, using the Chevy hydro boost is recommended. But as always, just hearsay until I have seen it with my own eyes.
 There is a guy on youtube that put a 4BT in a short-bed 1st Gen. An '85 IIRC. I've been trying to reach him to see it in person. Guess he lives up in NE Ohio, just about 3 hours from me. If I get the green light to come up, I am going to film an entire documentary on his rig.  ;D

Offline Mad Max

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2011, 04:17:32 PM »
...I am going to film an entire documentary on his rig.  ;D

 8) - {cool}
Official:  RamJam 2014 - Moab, Utah!!   8-12 September (Monday-Friday) - http://ramchargercentral.com/ram-jam/ramjam-2014-moab-utah-8-12-september-(official-dates)/


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Offline dyslexic teddybear

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2011, 05:46:00 PM »


Something else I heard recently, the 4BT's =SHAKE= a lot more than the 6BTs do, and are louder, which has disuaded several folks from a 4BT swap.

- Sam

Can confirm this.....to a point. Got about 20 hours in a leased piece of eqipment......powered by a 4bt....quite a bit rougher then a 6......but....VERY different motor mounts from a truck. A bit louder....too. It's kinda expected.....an inline six always seems to be pretty smooth.



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Offline airgrabber70

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #11 on: February 24, 2011, 09:33:06 PM »
hope this works.






Offline airgrabber70

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #12 on: February 24, 2011, 09:38:59 PM »
You guys are right about shaking.  When it sits and idles, the front tires wiggle slightly.  lots of vibration from a 4cyl. especially a diesel. 




Offline blueduster

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2011, 09:07:26 PM »
the one on youtube doeswn't seem to shake that much. still loud. i've been told when you have them dialed in the shake isn't bad. we'll see. i found one here in vegas out of a forklift, he's asking $2800obo. going to look at it tomorrow. not sure where i'll get the cash since i'm about to rebuild the AW4 in my cherokee. may have to sell some more stuff.
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Offline ToxicDoc

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2011, 11:58:45 PM »
the one on youtube doeswn't seem to shake that much. still loud. i've been told when you have them dialed in the shake isn't bad. we'll see. i found one here in vegas out of a forklift, he's asking $2800obo. going to look at it tomorrow. not sure where i'll get the cash since i'm about to rebuild the AW4 in my cherokee. may have to sell some more stuff.

That's a lot of money for the engine.  6BT's are listed for nearly half that.  Of course, it's not what you're looking for, but is that what a 4BT typically goes for?
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Offline blueduster

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #15 on: March 1, 2011, 07:08:04 PM »
i've seen them from $1500 to $3000 on the net. i've seen bread trucks go for that but it's hard to find one at all here which is why he's asking so much.

he did drop it to $2500 and i bet i could get it for 2k. i can't justify it yet though, gotta get the cherokee done first. need something to drive while i tear down the RC. we can't share 1 car because we work on opposite sides of town, 30 miles apart. don't like counting on 1 car anyway, fing Murphy is an ever present companion i'd like to drown in the lake.  >:( there is another add on craigs here that has a case 586 forklift with a blown up 4bt and an extra 4bt of unknown condition for $2500 today. so yes, that is a little high for just an engine.

i did go look at it though. i it is out of a forklift, has an air to water(coolant) intercooler set up i've never seen. in good shape externally and complete.
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Offline J10Mike

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #16 on: March 10, 2011, 04:46:34 PM »
Mike, I have a 4bt in a TD.  I used the small block rubber mounts from the 360 that I took out and made brackets that bolt to the engine (front 3 holes) and the stock v8 location on the crossmember.  It was really easy and I didn't take a picture again.   Scott
I hate it when I post a question and only check back once for an answer. I just saw all these replies today. Thanks all.
I do have a Non IC power steering/vacuum pump out of the 91 doner. Hopefully, that will work.
On the TD 4bt conversion, was there a need to move the tranny crossmember? From my measurements, it doesn't appear that it has to be moved.
I'm anxious to get started. Just waiting for it to get a little warmer.
www.j10mike.com

1977 Ramcharger, CTD 4bt/46rh/NP241, 6 inch lift, BFG M/T 35s, Front D60 w/Detroit Truetrac. Rear HD60 w/Detroit Locker.

2000 Dodge Ram 2500 QC, CTD, 4x4...Juiced.

2006 Dodge Charger R/T Daytona - DD

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Offline Mad Max

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #17 on: March 10, 2011, 04:53:07 PM »
I think only if it's getting an overdrive, and then again the same amount if it's got a lock-up converter.....I think :P ;D
Official:  RamJam 2014 - Moab, Utah!!   8-12 September (Monday-Friday) - http://ramchargercentral.com/ram-jam/ramjam-2014-moab-utah-8-12-september-(official-dates)/


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Offline airgrabber70

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #18 on: March 10, 2011, 08:33:00 PM »
I didn't move anything from the engine back.  Everything is in stock location, kept all linkages and brackets put, made it easy that way.  I don't know if I mentioned it has a NP435 also.  Not the best choice of trannys but is what I used and what it came with.  An NV4500 would be ideal.

Offline J10Mike

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #19 on: March 10, 2011, 11:12:00 PM »
I didn't move anything from the engine back.  Everything is in stock location, kept all linkages and brackets put, made it easy that way.  I don't know if I mentioned it has a NP435 also.  Not the best choice of trannys but is what I used and what it came with.  An NV4500 would be ideal.
Scott,
Did you also use the down pipe from the bread truck? I believe it is a 3 inch exhaust pipe. Any problem  with depth and getting that 3 inch pipe thru alongside the transfer case? Was there enough room?
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1977 Ramcharger, CTD 4bt/46rh/NP241, 6 inch lift, BFG M/T 35s, Front D60 w/Detroit Truetrac. Rear HD60 w/Detroit Locker.

2000 Dodge Ram 2500 QC, CTD, 4x4...Juiced.

2006 Dodge Charger R/T Daytona - DD

Former Rig: 1982 Jeep J10 Sportside.

Offline airgrabber70

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #20 on: March 12, 2011, 12:00:56 PM »
Mike, I'm not that far along yet.  I've been running it around the yard  with no exhaust at all.  I need a really sharp 90 elbow coming off the turbo to clear the firewall.  That is one obstacle yet.  I do have the bread truck downpipe also but not installed. Wish I had more time to work on it.  Its been almost 2 years since I've done anything to it. :'(  I'm vowing to be driving it this summer somehow.
Scott

Offline airgrabber70

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2011, 09:16:27 PM »
Mike, here are some pics of the mounts.  They aren't professional but will do the job.  They are nice and compact though. Used channel and flat.


« Last Edit: March 23, 2011, 09:19:54 PM by airgrabber70 »

Offline blueduster

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #22 on: April 11, 2011, 12:36:32 AM »
when i was at Mopars at the Strip this weekend, i talked to a guy that brought 3 rat rods and a 30s-40s flat bed truck, all cummins powered. two of the cars had 4bts. the one with regular mounts vibrated something fierce he said. the other used hydrualic fluid filled mounts from a ford taurus. he said it cut the vibration by 60-70%. thought you guys should know.
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Offline J10Mike

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #23 on: April 12, 2011, 09:49:21 PM »
That's good information. Thanks.
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1977 Ramcharger, CTD 4bt/46rh/NP241, 6 inch lift, BFG M/T 35s, Front D60 w/Detroit Truetrac. Rear HD60 w/Detroit Locker.

2000 Dodge Ram 2500 QC, CTD, 4x4...Juiced.

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Offline jhyneman

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #24 on: June 30, 2011, 05:58:40 PM »
I have done 4 conversions now.  not hard.  If you want a direct bolt in here is the list of parts you will need for your rc.  You need the motormounts from the grumman/ford van, rubber isolators from a 89-93 dodge diesel pickup, powersteering/ vacuum pump from a 93-97 dodge cummins, All the accessory mounts from the dodge cummins pickup.  I like taking the dodge cummins exhaust manifold and cutting the end 2 cylinders off and capping them so I can use a standard dodge 1989-93 exhaust system.  It is direct bolt in then.  If you want to run a clutch fan then get the fan idler pulley from a 89-93 dodge cummins.  You can find almost all the parts from ebay for under $500.  The dodge ram cummins motor mounts will work fine on the drivers side but will interfere with turbo return line on the passenger side.  I recommend using the A518 or the 47rh trans.  Lots of upgrade parts and fully hydraulic so no computers needed.  Just make sure you get the transfercase with it or use a divorced one.  Piece of cake.

Offline J10Mike

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Re: 4bt motor mounts
« Reply #25 on: June 30, 2011, 10:08:50 PM »
That's great information Thank you. I already have a power steering/vacuum pump off a 91 Dodge CTD. Will that not work?
I already have a freshly rebuilt CTD 46rh and 205 TC. And of course, the 4bt. Just have to get all the little nickel and dime stuff.
Again, Thanks.
www.j10mike.com

1977 Ramcharger, CTD 4bt/46rh/NP241, 6 inch lift, BFG M/T 35s, Front D60 w/Detroit Truetrac. Rear HD60 w/Detroit Locker.

2000 Dodge Ram 2500 QC, CTD, 4x4...Juiced.

2006 Dodge Charger R/T Daytona - DD

Former Rig: 1982 Jeep J10 Sportside.

 

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